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There are 'no gods' posted 05 Oct 2007, 08:10 by ErebusRed, Candidate

I suspect that the belief systems of the people of Earwa bear little resemblence to the true scheme of things. It is possible that the Gods do not exist at all, but are all creations of the various cultures. Just as in real life the depth, complexity and popularity of religion does not necessarily denote for a fact that any God exists. Akka seems (to me) the most ethical character - and part of this is his concern for the well-being on this world, this life, rather than some imagined hereafter. In fact he clings to his damnation and muses that he may be more righteous than those who strive for glory. The Consult schemes could revolve around a more profound understanding of the real cosmology of things than the people of Earwa can grasp. The heroes have perhaps framed the Consult's goals in the context of their own beliefs - mistakenly. Might it not also be possible therefore that the No-God is not 'evil' in the traditional sense, merely a force manipulated by the real villians the Consult. This may be why it's so hard to understand what the No-God is. As we are seeing the issue from a flawed theological position. view post

posted 10 Oct 2007, 17:10 by anor277, Didact

My impression from the novels was that the afterlife and pantheon were fairly well developed and appreciated on Earwa. That demons (lesser gods) and gods (greater demons) existed was a given, and that they would punish and reward certain behaviour seemed to be widely known. The No-God's activity, during his(?) brief existence, was just about the most frightening evil of which I've ever heard - the denial of fertility - he was aptly named, and all to the end of breaking the cycle of souls. view post

posted 30 Oct 2007, 07:10 by Guardsman Bass, Candidate

It's highly likely that the living Earwans' conception of deities is far from the complete pictures. I've suspected that since TTT's passage where Conphas and his men, fighting Cnaiur in the one city, see him outlined with the great shadow of the god Gilgaol (war itself). At the same time, we [i:26eu4n6g]do[/i:26eu4n6g] know that there is something to the whole "damnation" system, beyond the beliefs of the Inchoroi, Non-Men, and Men. When the one Scarlet Spires Sorceror (I can't remember his name; it begins with an "I") summoned a demon, it specifically mentioned that he was "damned" and asked if he "knew who would keep him for eternity?". view post

posted 27 Nov 2007, 22:11 by Angainawen, Candidate

I've never really thought about whether the theology of Earwa is something based solely on fact or if it is just an interpretation of actual events. I think, since there was a conscious choice to echo our universe's history in the events surrounding the Holy War, that theological beliefs of the Inrithi and Fanim are interpretations as are many if not all of our religions on Earth--including possibly the No-God itself. To dollop a new thought into the mix, let's say--since the topic has been raised before--that the Inchoroi are not of this world and therefore neither is the No-God. Like Cortez's acceptance by the Aztecs, it could easily be assumed that the peoples of Earwa termed the unknown in a means of their personal constructs and made it a god--or No-God since the agenda of this being is to detroy and not create. Granted this is a very Stargate-esque way of looking at PoN and one I am not so sure I have personally written as my interpretation of the story but it is a possible explanation, one that hinges on the idea that this is based on a recount of events, which I have personally assumed are based on the [i:3m94girv]Compendium of the First Holy War[/i:3m94girv]. This belief can also support Guardsman's comment on Caniur being in the shadow of Gilgaol. Many ancient ballads and epic poems, the Illiad springing foremost in my mind, recall such moments with Ares or Athena fighting beside or behind one of the battle's heroes. Since Bakker conceived of a world that naggingly recalls our own it could be easily said he too wished to convey the same type of metaphorical observations in the those of ancient works. Likewise Achamian's occaisonal sightings of the haloes around Kellhus' hands could also, in a literary sense, meerly show that he is slipping in and out of his personal belief of whether or not Kellhus is more than a man. OR, Achamian sees the foreign supernatural power, since they both are of the Few, within Kellhus and interprets it like Proyas and others as the haloes, which are also an echo to christian paintings and stained-glass artwork of saints. Yet, whether or not the God or any of its aspects actually exist does not truly matter in the large scheme of the story from what I got from it. The Holy War is about the acts of Men among Men wheras [i:3m94girv]the Sagas[/i:3m94girv] deal with the acts of Men with a more direct "other" presence, kinda like the War of the Ring is in terms to the events in [i:3m94girv]the Silmarillion[/i:3m94girv]. If the God and his aspects do exist, they have become reclusive, like the Valar became in [i:3m94girv]the Silmarillion[/i:3m94girv]. And yes, I have probably though too much into this book and no doubt am making several people sweat right now in concern for my sanity. view post

posted 01 Dec 2007, 00:12 by Angainawen, Candidate

Wow... I think I scared the discussion off with that one... ummmmm... whoops. That was my high school literary analysis class talking there.... view post

posted 01 Dec 2007, 01:12 by Shell, Peralogue

Angainawen, I wish I had gone to your high school... :) Shell view post

posted 02 Dec 2007, 03:12 by Harrol, Moderator

Shell I did not know Wisconsin had high schools :shock: Angainawen yeah thanks for scaring me off with all your deep thinking. :evil: view post

posted 02 Dec 2007, 04:12 by Angainawen, Candidate

I sorry... :oops: :oops: view post


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