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Christianity: Revelations posted 03 Dec 2006, 22:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

Okay, might not so long awaited Christianity discussion. It will not include my views on jesus and Christianity as a whole because I do not have the capacity to write for that many hours straight at this point and time. Nor, do I feel the need to be so controversial. So sticking to current Christian beliefs that some will find interesting I will procede: The Rapture of the church: illustrated in the left behind series so some of you have a general idea of what this is. so, in the bible it says that 3 generations after the budding of the fig tree jesus will return (rapture) the budding of the fig tree is currently believed to be when israel became a nation this happened in 1948. a bible generation is 20 years therefore 3 generations is 60 years so 3 generations after the budding of the fig tree would be 2008. my point/question here is how do you view this information? and what do you think its implications are? what happens if the rapture doesnt happen? misconception by many on what the budding really was? or something far more grim for the christian community? view post

hmmm posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by TheDarkness, Peralogue

Well the rapture as i understand it is not when Jesus will reutrn but when all believers will be called up to heaven and leave the sinners of the world to their own devices. After the rapture there will be seven years of tribulation with the Anti-Christ at the helm. After seven years Jesus will return adn there will be Armegedon, The devil will be cast into the lake of fire and there will be a thousand years of peace on earth until alll are taken to heaven. But I believe that the believers will not be dismayed if they are not taken in 2008. Just some more time to save some more souls from eternal damnation view post

posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

sorry i did say something i didnt mean. i meant that he would call for those who were christian...not actually come down...sorry. question? why only 1000 years of peace? and is a thousand years our current understanding of a year? because if this is so than that is not that long at all view post

posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

Still a year of peace would beat out the thousands of years of violence. view post

posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by TheDarkness, Peralogue

hmm thats a good question. time seems pretty irrelevant if it is not used correctly. maybe its to make sure that satan stays in his hole. i believe that at the end of the thousand years he does come bak acnd convert some more Christians. is there a specific verse in revelations where it says when the rapture will happen? all this stuff is intersting to me i wonder how the Christian version of the Apocolypse stacks up against those of other religions. view post

posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

Well the Norse believe that Fenrir/Fenris will break free of his chain and devour Odin and the Earth during what they call Ragnarok and the world's only chance is one of Odin's sons who's name escapes me at the moment defeats him but thats only one aspect of the story. view post

posted 03 Dec 2006, 23:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

I do not remember where exactly in the bible these things are located...I studied them years ago...the idea just stuck with me. WP - I agree that one day of peace would be adequate *joking in next sentence* but if there is total peace and no one dies then we are left with over population from the multitude that hasnt died that day. *end joke* However, what do you view will happen in 2008 if anything? view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 00:12 by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

Personally I think it can go either away I mean theres always end of the world theories floating down and interpretation is so varied that the world could go bang tommorrow, The Mayans seem to think 2012 is there year and there are so many end of the world ideas I think the only questions that remain are is the world ever going to end and how is it going to end? view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 00:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

interesting i will start a new topic on such in a second view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 03:12 by Cordelia, Auditor

Hmm, very interesting, correct me if I am wrong but did it say that a war would happen in Israel and once that war did happen, the world would end? I'm not sure where I heard that, it was either while discussing the Bible or from another source. Someone please correct me if my information is incorrect. I actually read a book by Dean Koontz not too long ago that is about the end of the world, it was called, "The Taking". It made me think quite a bit. No one knew what was going on in the book, it wasn't until the end that the heroin put the clues together and figured out what happened/was happening. This makes me wonder whether or not we will even know the end of the world/apocalypse/Armageddon is even happening. We may overlook the truth of it and try to find a logical reason. The end of the world, how ever it will end, may disguise itself as nothing more than a series of terrible natural disasters, slowly working it's way to it's terrifying climax. That is when we will know what is truly happening. Well, it's an idea anyways. view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 03:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

yes the wars of israel are one recognition...and currently israel is warring and according to the bible their nation shall be undefeated...with a helping hand from the west (hmmm, the USA perhaps?) I agree with the end of the world theory that you presented to an extent....i think global warming is in "the day after tomorrow"...but who knows... view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 04:12 by Cordelia, Auditor

It's a possibility. You may want to read The Taking, it's very good. it was basically like a cleansing. It took many people, some to Heaven, some to Hell... then others were left on the Earth and everything seemed at peace. No one really knew what had actually happened though. view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 04:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

i will look into it view post

posted 04 Dec 2006, 04:12 by Cordelia, Auditor

Good. view post

posted 05 Dec 2006, 06:12 by alhana, Auditor

**edit Sorry for my poor spelling....I will try to fix it when I am more alert** The trouble with most of the prophetic books of the Bible is that they were written in a form of literature that tends to be very alagoric in the orginal language. Jesus Christ himself told his followers that they would not know the time or hour of His Return. Also, to God, a day could be a 1000 years and a generation could be a million. In the 1960s, there was a book series written called the [i:2tmb5401]Late Great Planet Earth [/i:2tmb5401] in which they based all of their writings on current events at the times. With the Cold War and the Cuban Missel Crisis and Viet Nam, Christians back then really thought that Christ was coming back anytime. But here we are 40 years later. Throughout history, any attempts to "foretell" when this event might happen have been met with rather disappointing results. Some people think the Saints will all be gathered when Christ first returns to Earth...these are the ones in who believe in the Left Behind style of the end of the world. They are called Pre-Millenialists or Pre-Tribs because they believe they will go to heaven and miss all of the crappy stuff that is supposed to happen before the 1000 years of peace. Then there are those who like suffering....JK!!! and they believe that everyone, Christians and sinners, will live through the trials and tribulation times in Revelation. These folks are called Post-Tribs or Post-Millienialists...because they won't go to heave till after God brings his Kingdom to earth and the 1000 years of Peace comes. Then there is a very very small camp of people who believe that God's Kingdom has already come to earth. They believe this happened sometime about 40 years after the Nation of Israel was founded. The Christian Music Artist Sandi Patti was associated with some of the folks who thought that God's Kingdom had already come. It seems that every generation looks around and sees some new catastrophe that can't possibly be resolved or they think that mankind can not possibly get anymore vile. They look at the Bible and find "clues" that must mean that the world is going to end soon and so they stick their head in the sand and ignore the greatest commandment of love others as much as you love yourself. Instead of worrying about when any of this might happen, we should make the world a better place to live. If and when it happens, we won't be able to do anything about it Eat, Drink, and Be Merry.....wait....wrong religion!!!! view post

posted 05 Dec 2006, 21:12 by Harrol, Moderator

Alhana that is correct we are suppose watch and pray and fulfill the Great Commision. We are not suppose to run around talking bad about evry little thing. view post

posted 05 Dec 2006, 23:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

yes but since the generation of 20 years is used as a measurement all over the bible so in that same context is where i lay mt equation. view post

posted 06 Dec 2006, 15:12 by Harrol, Moderator

Measurements of time are difficult in the Bible. The prophesies of the Messiah refer to His coming as the day of the Lord, but Jesus was not here for a day but for 33 years. A lot of the time these things are mere references to time periods rather than strict 24 hour days or 20 year periods. view post

posted 07 Dec 2006, 03:12 by Sorcerous-Words, Auditor

of course a day of the lord could be referred to when he was born...or his crucifiction...or that sure it wasnt meant literall.................. view post

posted 17 Dec 2006, 17:12 by Randal, Auditor

The end of the world has been predicted thousands of times, literally. The apostles believed (or some of them did) that Jezus would return in their lifetimes. All the early christians believed it would be but a few decades. In the year 1000 hordes of people left their homes to preach the end of days that was sure to come, for example. The have been millions and millions of prophecies throughout history. Vague words and sentences have been interpreted in hundreds of ways. Who is "the short haired man"? Or what is your "fig tree"? Plausible cases can undoubtedly be made for it to be any of several dozen things. It's speculation on speculation, supposition on supposition. All in all, it's a castle build on clouds. Even if you believe the bible to be true, there is no reason to believe the end days are just around the corner. Anyway, I had heard that the whole rapture belief was rather controversial even within christianity, and that it doesn't actually say anything definite about it in the bible. I'd also heard that the rapture theology only arose somewhere in the last century or so. view post

posted 18 Dec 2006, 13:12 by Harrol, Moderator

Randal the rapture is controversial due to the fact that many people who claim to be Christians pick and choose what scripture verses they will follow and ignore others. That of course is the case for a lot of other topics too. view post


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