the archives

dusted off in read-only


Kyraneas = Cyrene? posted 26 Apr 2006, 16:04 by talek, Candidate

"Kyraneas" suggests "Cyrene," an ancient Greek colony (now Shahlat) in Lybia. OK, it's a little farfetched (although "c" and "k" are both widely used to transliterate the same Greek letter, kappa, so that Cyrene=Kyrene), but there is also this: the native Lybians called on the Egyptian Pharoah (= Mog-[i:22zdyjyj]Pharau[/i:22zdyjyj]?) to help them throw the Greeks out. Pharaoh was, however defeated. Note that "Anaxophus," as in "Anaxophus V, defeater of Mog-Pharau," is a name of Greek flavor ("anax" = "prince"). view post

posted 26 Apr 2006, 18:04 by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

There are many hundreds of connections in names that can be made. view post

posted 27 Apr 2006, 13:04 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

And given how Scott likes History it's a given. I don't think you can read fantasy and not have references, especially in names, to other works and historical places/people. view post

posted 27 Apr 2006, 14:04 by talek, Candidate

That's what I'm assuming. I'm just trying to work out the details. Well, there is this question: suppose we have a word in a three Seas language which has a striking resemblance to a word in an ancient Earth language. Is this (a) just a way of making the word sound ancient, to give a bit of atmosphere, (b) a reference to something in our history, the recognition of which will enrich our experience as readers, or (c) suggestive of some parallel or connection between the two worlds? In the case of Kyreneas/Pharaoh, I'm not convinced yet that anything more than (a), plus a little coincidence, is involved. In some cases, however, Mr. Bakker uses ancient Greek words without alteration, and in such a way that their meaning in the Three Seas is the same, or nearly the same, as their meaning in ancient Greek; for example, "Logos." This is a rather striking effect (like giving a character the name "George"). It suggests a kind of bleed-through between that world and our own. view post

posted 27 Apr 2006, 14:04 by talek, Candidate

Another example: "animas" in the Glossary (TTT, p. 410) is described as The "moving force" of all existence, typically analyzed as the "Breath of God." Now, in Latin, "anima" means "breath," and sometimes "soul" (although this would more usually be "animus"). In the ancient world there were many who believed that the world had a soul. The soul of something was often thought of as its moving force, hence our words "animated," "animation," and so on. The Glossary goes on to mention that some people think that this may be the same as "onta." "Onta" suggests a present participle of the ancient Greek word "to be," i.e., it could be taken to mean "being," which would be appropriate in this case. It seems highly unlikely that these are coincidences. Whether Mr. Bakker means to suggest a bleed-through, or some other connection with our world, or whether this is just meant to be an atmospheric effect, I don't know. view post

posted 28 Apr 2006, 12:04 by Entropic_existence, Moderator

I wouldn't read too much into it like a connection between our world and the world of the books. Scott loves language and using words from our own ancient languages as models or even part of the vocabulary of a "made up" language is pretty standard practice. It gives something mildly familiar to the reader and can be used as a guide for shaping your own language. view post


The Three Seas Forum archives are hosted and maintained courtesy of Jack Brown.