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Inchoroi, Souls, the Outside [TTT Spoilers] posted 28 Feb 2006, 15:02 by Big Jim Dwyer, Commoner

Hi, Scott, If my question has already been asked, please ignore it. I found your explanation of the Consult's motivation extremely elegant, a nice twist on the perennial problem of explaining evil overlords; however, I can't quite make it all add up. My problem lies with the Inchoroi's origin (i.e. from another planet). Were they always damned? Or were they damned only upon entering Earwa? I am not too fond of the only options I can think of. If the Inchoroi were always damned, then their mission would be to wipe out all "souled" life in the universe--a bit of a tall order. If, however, damnation only occurred when the Inchoroi landed on Earwa, then there is physical dimension of some kind to the Outside, which seems to go against Kellhus' "Here speech" (unless he's just pulling yet another fast one on Achamian) and would diminish the power of the Outside (at least in my opinion). If I am being particularly obtuse please forgive me; or, if the answers would contain spoilers, I understand perfectly. That you even answer some of these questions is above and beyond the call of duty. Big Jim Dwyer view post

One Possibility... posted 28 Feb 2006, 20:02 by Ikiru, Candidate

I thought of this same thing while reading. While only Scott knows for sure, my take was that the moral laws that govern damnation and salvation are a feature of Earwa, not the entire universe. The power of Earwa's God or Gods does not extend through the "Void" of space; it is intrinsic to the planet. So the Inchoroi are damned because of what they've done ON EARWA, and will go to Earwa's hell if they die there. By this rationale, if they could repair the Ark and leave, they'd be safe from damnation, but since they've lost their technology, they are stuck in this world where intelligent, "souled" creatures are subject to supernatural moral judgment. That's how I saw it. But it could be just the opposite - the Gods could hold sway throughout the whole universe, meaning the Inchoroi would have to annhilate all intelligent life. Still, since they seem to think killing men and nonmen would be enough, I think the Earwa-specific situation makes more sense. Of course, it's still not clear what convinced them of the existence of the Gods in the first place. view post

posted 15 Mar 2006, 17:03 by Cu'jara Cinmoi, Author of Prince of Nothing

This is a good question, and these are all issues I've settled in my own mind (which isn't always the case), but as I say, since metaphysical systems in the real world are open, vague, and apparently inconsistent, I think I would actually do damage to the world by laying out a comprehensive, canonical metaphysics. It's like the old horror film trope: sometimes what you don't see can be the most vivid thing of all. view post

posted 27 Apr 2006, 21:04 by talek, Candidate

Just to add a few other possibilities: (1) Perhaps the Inchoroi were already in trouble in the universe at large, and they thought they could escape by taking one planet and sealing it off. The use of the term "Ark" suggests that they were already fleeing something. One possible reason for their being in trouble in the first place might be, that in seeking immortality (or something) they tinkered with themselves too much, and lost something crucial (soul, or consciousness, or ethics, or whatever)) in the process. As a matter of fact, I think this is soon going to be a live issue for humanity in the 'real' world: we are developing genetic engineering and other forms of biotechnology, and we will soon be in a position to tinker with ourselves quite profoundly. Their arrival seems to have been a crash rather than a landing; that is compatible with the above theory, but not accounted for by it. So perhaps the following is better: (2) The Ark was a spaceship or satellite, or some fantasy-genre equivalent; when it crashed, all aboard were killed. The medical program aboard the Ark brought their bodies back to life, or perhaps made new bodies, but could not give them souls (or consciousness, or ethics, or whatever). It thereby (unintentionally) created abominations, which had, however, a desire to survive; hence the rest of the story. (2*, a variant of (2)): Perhaps only the computer survived, or perhaps there was only a computer in the Ark prior to the crash, and the computer, which lacks moral judgment, has created artificial beings, including the Inchoroi, as tools, in order to give itself power in the world. (3) Somewhere, deep in the Ark, are beings who do have souls (or whatever), but who, out of fear, have created the Inchoroi (etc.) as tools. In this they have sinned, as they know full well, so they want to seal themselves off. view post

posted 27 Apr 2006, 23:04 by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

I think the Inchoroi were largely wiped out but a few survived. view post

posted 28 Apr 2006, 10:04 by Curethan, Didact

Ooooo, the true nature of the Inchoroi has yet to be revealed methinks. The motivations explained in TTT seem to relate mainly to the consult. Here's some speculation for ya. A what if, if you like. The Inchoroi are bio-robots, programmed to terraform the world for whatever lifeform was originally contained in the ark. Thus their attempts to wipe out the non-men. The non-men kicked their butts, and the Consult have co-opted what was left of the Inchoroi and the Tekne to their own twisted ends... Unlikely, but whatever, I just like running off with other people's ideas. view post

posted 25 May 2006, 17:05 by Big Jim Dwyer, Commoner

Thanks for answering (or not answering), Scott. Although frustrating, your response is probably the best in terms of enjoying your created world. Earwa is too realistic to have pat answers. Middle-Earth certainly became less mysterious when you can explain most things with: "He's a Maia." Big Jim Dwyer view post


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