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White Lord Subdidact | joined 26 December 2004 | 212 posts


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 13 January 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

In my opinion it's much more likely his mother is a skin-spy... view post


Art for TTT? posted 13 January 2005 in Author Q & AArt for TTT? by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: "Cu'jara Cinmoi":1xtang6r
*deep breath*

News to me Mith.

But rest assured, I'll be kicking and screaming for a gif, and I'll post it as soon as I find out.

How many times have you done this to me now? <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->

The author is always the last to know. And why not, I only write the damn things...[/quote:1xtang6r]

That's really good news... I'll be looking forward to seeing it also!

As an aside... I've been trying to download the maps of Earwa from your PoN site and I can't... I've been wondering if I'm the only one or if it's a mistake on the site.
I'd much appreciate if it could be fixed, or if you, Mr. Bakker, could post them here or send them to my e-mail.

Looking forward to your reply! view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 15 January 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;anor277&quot;:5rejrkju
I agree, I think it's much more likely that Xerius' mother Istriya is a skin spy (perhaps replaced just after Skeaös was revealed). The evidence is very circumstantial of course, Istriya opposes Xerius' plan to spare Shimeh (and the Cishaurim) from conquest, which is presumably a Consult aim; however, Istriya would be uniquely vulnerable to replacement by a skin-spy. She takes numerous lovers and also chooses lovers for her son Xerius, any of whom could be a skin spy and could dispose of her and masquerade as her quite easily. All of this raises an interesting question, are the skin-spies hermaphroditic; can they change their genitals as well as their faces? Yuck, the mind boggles.[/quote:5rejrkju]

What made me think about her being a skin-spy was the scene where, immediately after Skeaös's death she brings that girl to Xerius, exploiting one of his weaknesses and then asking him what exactly happened to Skeaös in what seemed a very sinister undertone to me....

It is also possible (even probable) that she was removed immediately after Skeaös's death and replaced with a skin-spy for getting to the bottom of his death. view post


A few questions . . . posted 15 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

First of all I’d like to congratulate you, Mr. Bakker, on a great fantasy series, published at a time when I was despairing of finding anything worthy of being read anymore.

I just finished consuming TDtCB and TWP in the space of two days and I have to say I’m very impressed with the world you’ve created (very realistic and even ruthless at times, which is a welcome change) and the way the story and the characters have progressed so far.

Since finishing to read the books I’m finding myself full of questions so I hope I’m not being too demanding with the (many) ones that follow, and I really hope you will be able to answer at least a few . . .

Here goes:

1. I’m interested in the demographics of the Ancient North. Just how do they compare with those of the Three Seas, both now and in the period of its greatest glory (at the time of Cenei?), and what were the borders (and sizes) of the ancient Norsirai nations? For ex. was Agongorea a part of Kuniüri or a preexisting kingdom before it was taken by the Consult?

2. Many times you mention that the Ancient North was old, powerful and very civilized, at a time when the Three Seas, and possibly the Satyothi peoples too, were young and still unsophisticated. I wonder just how that is possible, if we reckon that the Four Nations invaded Eärwa at the same time and probably settled their respective corners of it at the same time as well. The colossal monuments of Shigek, and some other mentions of antiquity in the Three Seas would seem to contradict that, and although the Norsirai may have had the advantage of the Nonman Tutelage, two thousand years constitute a long time, and I think the Ketyai could easily have caught up with them easily.

3. In TWP Achamian speaks of the killing of the No-God and in this context tells Kellhus of the Holy War Celmomas had called to battle the Consult. He says Celmomas “summoned” all the lords of Eärwa, and I read that to be the actual summons of a liege lord to his vassals. So I’d like to know if I’m reading too much into this sentence or if the Anasûrimbor really were in a position to order other kings of the ancient world. (An alternative question: just how powerful and important were the Anasûrimbor, and how old was their line, at the time of the Apocalypse?)

4. Concerning the Cunuroi. In TDtCB, Mekeritrig tells Kellhus that when their heart had been cut out they cradled theirs, being companions to the ‘great’ Norsirai kings. All this was in the context of the degradation of the Cunuroi (their curse) so it made me think . . . After all why would a species be given near-eternal life only to be crippled in a different way than mortality, as the Cunuroi seem to be? I got the impression that this was the consequence of the death of one of their kings or this and the result of something the Inchoroi did to them. Is there any truth to this or were they always cursed to only five human lifetimes’ memories?

5. Checking out the maps I happened to notice a city or citadel, in the Osthwai Mountains between Thunyerus and Galeoth, that has a very Cunuroi-sounding name: Col-Aujas. Is this in fact a Nonman city-state and what may its relations be with the Norsirai of the Three Seas, if any? This is especially interesting since I thought that all remaining Cunuroi were in Injor-Niyas and that the presence of the Nonmen so close to the Three Seas could possibly have meant another source of the Gnosis for the local Schools.

6. The Celmomian Prophecy. When Celmomas describes seeing his son taking the sun as his charger and stirring his people to wonder and fury, is he in fact seeing his own dead son, or is it maybe Kellhus (or the son of Kellhus?), and their actions in the books’ present? In other words, is what Kellhus thinks: that just as what comes before determines what comes after, it could also be that what comes after influences what comes before, in any way possible? Is this prophecy a demonstration of this posit?

Here are the questions. I thought it better to lump them all in one post than to bother you with many staggered ones, and I’m thanking you in advance for any answer! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 17 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1n5v63kv
Two days! I'm glad you enjoyed the books, White Lord. I can tell by your questions that you're a classic 'world junkie' - a man after my own heart![/quote:1n5v63kv]

Yes, I guess I am a world junkie and I have to say once again that I'm really impressed with the depth of this one, which is one of the reasons why I have so many questions... I really hope you'll publish a guide to Eärwa someday; it would make for some interesting complementary reading to the series. BTW, just how many books will there be in each of the follow-up series, 2 or 3? I've been seeing here that it's to be 2...

As far as I'm concerned you can write six more books easy, there's no reason to disdain long series if the writing's good and the story interesting, and I have no reason to believe otherwise. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1n5v63kv
1) In terms of population, I see the two as being comparable, though the Three Seas necessarily has some cultural (such as a deeper history) and technological advantages (such as iron). The primary difference between the civilizations (with the exception that one is dead) lay in the maritime and commercial dimensions of the Three Seas.[/quote:1n5v63kv]

The issue of iron makes me wonder about the Nonman nimil. Just what exactly is nimil, and why didn't the Nonmen share it with their Norsirai allies? The scene between Mekeritrig and Kellhus comes to mind, and the way nimil and steel seem to be more or less equal...

Also, something I forgot in my first post..., just how big is Eärwa? I always imagine Eärwa to be the size of Europe in relation to Eänna being the size of Asia, both of them making up something close to the Eurasian landmass size-wise. Is this accurate? What is Eärwa's size compared to a real-world continent?


Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1n5v63kv
4) You're starting to mow some TTT grass with this one, I'm afraid! Sorry, WL... <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> [/quote:1n5v63kv]

Very interesting! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> I guess this non-answer points somewhere in the direction I was going... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> Can't wait for TTT!

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1n5v63kv
5) Cil-Aujas is a dead Nonman city that the Men of the Three Seas know about. Something I have some dev[i]lish plans for. [/quote:1n5v63kv]

Also very interesting. Is it to be in TTT or one of the follow-up series?

And to close just one more question.

About sorcerers. One of the excerpts at the beginning of a chapter argues that since the gods are the architects of the world and had a purpose for everything, then why are sorcerers always called cheaters? And who made the rules of sorcery? What is their place in the grand scheme of things?

I happen to believe that they have a purpose although some of the metaphysics they use may be thought offensive to the world. I have some idea that Moënghus is developing some form of sorcery that doesn't damage the creation of the gods, one also that may resist the Aporos, that being the reason the Consult is so eager to annihilate the Cishaurim.

About the Aporos. Are Aporetic cants only good for unravelling the cants of other sorceries or can they be used offensively, like those of the Gnosis or Anagogis?

Why are sorcerers called Unclean in the Tusk?

I believe that they were called that because the migrating nations were in fact fleeing from wars in Eänna that were heavy on sorcery, so anything to do with sorcery would automatically be anathema to them. Am I right in this?

Also are there any Norsirai, Ketyai etc. still left in Eänna or was the migration of the Four Nations similar to the barbaric invasions on our own world where literally whole peoples were on the move?

Thanks again for your reply above, and hope I'm not pestering you with my questions. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 19 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Thanks again for the quick answers! Also looking forward to the goodies in the appendices to TTT.

I've been wondering about the golden haloes around Kellhus's arms. At first I thought they were merely hallucinations, something he induced in others through some Dunyain technique for the furthering of his mission, instead of real manifestations from the Outside or wherever the Gods are. Now though I think of them as perhaps being both: at first hallucinations (Kellhus trying to manipulate the world-born) and then also the first manifestations of his true position as a prophet, as the story unfolds. Am I right?

Also I don't know if you missed the question earlier or if it's one of those 'read and find out' ones. Anyway I'm interested in knowing whether there are any more Norsirai, Ketyai etc. peoples still living in Eanna, or if the migrations really comprised whole nations. view post


A few questions . . . posted 20 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:dgglhln8
I'm not sure I understand the question, WL... <!-- s:roll: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_rolleyes.gif" alt=":roll:" title="Rolling Eyes" /><!-- s:roll: -->[/quote:dgglhln8]

Just a little clarification, please: did you mean to give that rolleyes emoticon a sarcastic or suggestive meaning? Because its accepted meaning is sarcasm -- though I didn't read any in your answer, so I take it to be suggestive.

I guess this means I'll get the answers in the books at some point. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> I just wish I came up with answerable questions, as it's kinda painful to be on tenterhooks about one's theories all the time! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->

Also a few questions (and please tell me if I'm bothering you; wouldn't want you to waste time on silly questions as I guess you're busy writing TTT):

1. About the Sranc. In the scene where Kellhus battles the Sranc in the North we get a description of one of the Sranc's face as being beautiful. Now fast forward to where Akka is tortured by the Scarlet Spires, and his flashbacks to Seswatha's torture at the Mantraitor's hands. Again his face is described as inhumanly beautiful.

Now since I know that the Sranc were made by the Inchoroi as a weapon against the Cunuroi, I get the impression that this is an example of perverted Inchoroi sense of humor. I think they manipulated Cunuroi genes and basically preserved Cunuroi faces (beautiful) putting them on misshapen (freakish) bodies, as a way to taunt the Cunuroi. If I'm right I wish I had witnessed their first encounter! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> So is there any truth to this or am I just imagining too much? And why do I think I just might not get an answer to this one either? <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

2. Caste-nobility. Towards the end of TWP Kellhus is accused of being a pretender to the warrior caste. Now since he is the rightful Crown Prince of Kuniuri (regardless of the fact that his nation is 2000 years dead) how can he be a pretender? Even if he misrepresented himself as a prince of Atrithau his nobility should be unquestioned: a similar thing to Saubon's status (a lackland prince but still a prince, though of dubious authority).

So I guess the gist of this one is: are there any differences in the concept of nobility in the Ancient North and the Three Seas? Did caste-nobility as such exist in the Ancient North or was it a much less rigid and closed system with upward mobility?

For that matter can a caste-merchant or -menial move upward to the warrior/nobility caste in the Three Seas? view post


A few questions . . . posted 20 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1my59qy3
No, no, I was using it in the 'oops' sense! I truly didn't understand your question. And it's no bother at all, believe me.[/quote:1my59qy3]

Good to hear that! Also glad not to be a bother. <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Anyway, maybe I should put the question this way: somewhere in TWP people start seeing disks of golden light around Kellhus's hands (the sign of the prophet; the exact way Inri Sejenus is portrayed in temple mosaics etc.) At first I thought these golden disks weren't real, just the result of Kellhus hypnotizing people to reinforce his position as possible prophet. But at the book's end I thought them really there (unless Kellhus has learned how to hypnotize thousands simultaneously!). So which is it: can we consider Kellhus a real prophet by book's end or is he still playing mind games with the Inrithi?

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1my59qy3
1) I think I should save this one for the striptease...[/quote:1my59qy3]

Can't wait... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1my59qy3
2) As with all things political, it's the conflux of perception and entrenched interests that matters. Just look at the Inaugural Celebrations in Washington today. Just look at who is celebrating...[/quote:1my59qy3]

So I guess it was more a case of them doing what was politically expedient than really believing him not to be a noble...

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1my59qy3
The castes are strictly hereditary in the Three Seas. There would have been somewhat more mobility in the Ancient North, but only because in many ways they retained the 'freeman' tribal structure of their ancestors.[/quote:1my59qy3]

That is the way I thought the system worked too. But I guess we'll see some changes, at least, in the Three Seas when Kellhus is Aspect-Emperor... <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Also reformulating one of my previous questions: you said the Four Nations migrated from Eanna to Earwa, and that a 'Lost Nation' remained behind, on the other side of the Kayarsus.

So I assume at least the Xiuhianni are still living in Eanna. But what about other members of the Four Nations, people who didn't want to migrate to Earwa? Do they still live in Eanna, do they have kingdoms there?

For that matter are there other races of Man, distinct from the five we know about, living anywhere in the world?

Thanks again! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 22 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:qffn9sa7
I actually haven't worked out any details for lands surrounding Earwa, and nor do I have any plans to. One of the things that characterizes the ancient relation to the world is ignorance, the sense of occupying a small circle of light in a dark and cavernous room. This may just be bias on my part, but I think Erikson and Martin worry the readerly illusion a bit by 'going global' the way they do.[/quote:qffn9sa7]

I don't think you are necessarily wrong in not developing any more lands aside from Earwa. I guess it depends much on the story you decided to tell, and not introducing superfluous details of any kind is a plus. Also there's the fact that there is a lot of past history to Earwa, and the land itself is rich enough in so many other ways, that I know readers will be more than satisfied with the books to come and the details you will share with us, even without you 'going global'.

Part of my interest in Eanna is simply born of the fact that it exists on the maps and that it's (probably) the birthplace of Man, so I can't not have some interest in it. For that matter you not telling anything about it is also a real stimulus for the imagination and the 'there be dragons' outlook on the world, that characterized imperfect knowledge of world geography in centuries past.

Now on to some questions:

1. Are there any female Dunyain? I mean girls or women who undergo the Conditioning process alongside the men?

2. Is the Dunyain conditioning process something that has to start at a young age, or can grown men (and women) be trained (at least to some extent)?

3. Can women work sorcery of the kind the schools (both Gnostic and Anagogic) practice?

4. Can you tell us anything on the city of Tryse? Something of its history, how big was it compared to the big cities of the Three Seas today etc.

Thanks a lot! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 23 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:3m4kdk4e
The only question out of these that doesn't find itself pinned to a important part of the future story has to do with women and sorcery (and even then!). Yes, as many women are born to the 'Few' as men, but due to oppression, they have no formal tradition as such: they're typically burned as witches. Neither the Schools nor the mundane powers tolerate sorcery outside the aegis of the Schools, so wizards suffer much the same fate.

I think I should cut it short there, since it becomes quite significant in AE.[/quote:3m4kdk4e]

I suspected I wouldn't get many answers to these questions... Anyway you confirmed my hypothesis on sorcery and women... so thanks! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

BTW, reading another post on sorcery I see you characterized the power or strength of the Few as involving intellect and experience. So how would you rate Achamian's sorcerous prowess, both compared to other Mandati, as well as Anagogic sorcerers?

I think there's more to him than one would think given his apparent weakness of character, and since he seems fated to be Kellhus's teacher it's something I'd like to have an idea of... view post


A few questions . . . posted 23 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

One more thing that interests me: does Seswatha's Heart induce the Dreams only in sorcerers or can it affect anyone who touches it?

Thanks! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 24 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:22iykn0q
Another one verging on TTT... <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> It's safe to assume that there some very ritualized, very long, Cants involved.[/quote:22iykn0q]

OK <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> I sure wish TTT were already published...


Some questions:

1. Leafing through the appendices in TDtCB I noticed in the Languages of Men section a mention to a language of the Meorn Empire. Is this a Norsirai empire from the early days of the Ancient North?

Strangely enough, it never occurred to me that in 2000 years many nations could have risen and fallen in the Ancient North before the ones we see on the maps were even born... something similar to the situation in the Three Seas.

2. Can you tell us anything more about the Anasurimbor line, if possible, aside from what we know from the books, something that isn't going to spoil the future storylines?

3. Will the character Aengelas from the end of TWP appear in future books, and what did the Inchoroi mean when he said he could sense the 'old fire' in him?

Thanks a lot! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


This time I got a question... posted 25 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AThis time I got a question... by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Annabel&quot;:1ezgkd4v
Maybe our favorite author should write The Thousandfold Thought in rhymes. Maybe Cnaiur could start up with a little gangsta rap at the start of every meeting of the great names.[/quote:1ezgkd4v]

<!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: --> That's a good one! And I think you're not so very wrong either... view post


A few questions . . . posted 25 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Mithfânion&quot;:918larjm
Aengelas

I love that name. I hope we'll be seeing more of him.[/quote:918larjm]

Agreed, a really cool name. I like all the names in the books... Don't see exactly what the deal is with the people who think them too hard to pronounce or whatever... I guess they're too used to the cliched or monosyllabic ones that glut most Fantasy works. Throw in a few strange accents and you make them go into meltdown... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 25 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:h25b6cn4
1) Yes. Actually most of the Norsirai from the so-called 'Middle-North' are descendents of Meornish refugees, who would eventually be responisible for the destruction of the Nonman Mansion of Cil-Aujas.

I actually have a history worked out for the Ancient North, every bit as layered as that for the Three Seas.[/quote:h25b6cn4]

Interesting... Hope we'll read more of the early history of the Ancient North in future books.

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:h25b6cn4
2) I going to keep mum on the Anasurimbor for now. I actually have an outline for a stand alone dealing with the First Apocalypse.[/quote:h25b6cn4]

OK. Could you just say whether their nobility/royalty dates back to the nation of Kuniuri or if their line stretches back to earlier times?

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:h25b6cn4
3) The 'old fire' would be the blood of his ancestors. As for Aengelas - well things don't look all that good for him at the end of TWP![/quote:h25b6cn4]

Well I know he was in a bit of trouble <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> but I have the feeling he's managed to survive... view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 25 January 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Erthaelion&quot;:1wkw4ksk
Hasn't been a female skin-spy revealed yet.

Hard to imagine the "things" being anything other then male, but upon re-reading that scene, it does seem like something strange was going on. And the skin-spies did discover, very suddenly, that Kellhus could see them. Just out of the blue, at a council of the Great names, bang- Sarcellus is staring down Kellhus.

hmm....[/quote:1wkw4ksk]

Well the reason there aren't (many/any) female skin-spies is than few women have any power or influence in the Three Seas. But I'd think the "technical" side of making them would be pretty simple... after all if you can make a male skin-spy, why shouldn't you be able to engineer a female one?

And now that Skeaos is dead Ikurei Istriya is the only person who will have some influence on Xerius, and I think this (and Xerius's actions in Book 3) will be significant. view post


A few questions . . . posted 28 January 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:2rb1u9ro
If I remember correctly, House Anasurimbor rises to prominence around five centuries before the First Apocalypse - but I'd have to go digging into the 'pile' to be sure.[/quote:2rb1u9ro]

Thanks for this tidbit!

A question: in one of your answers you mention Quya and Siqu masters. We know who the Quya are, so what are the Siqu?

Thanks again! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 01 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:352m9453
The Siqu are the Nonmen advisors to the ancient Norsirai Kings during the Nonman Tutelage...

You sent me digging for this one. I thought I would post this little teaser of what to expect in the apendices to TTT:

&#65279;820 - The Rape of Omindalea. Jiricet, a Nonman
Siqû to the God-King Nincarû-Telesser II
(787-828), rapes Omindalea (808-825), first
daughter of Sanna-Neorjë (772-858) of the
house of Anasûrimbor in 824, and then flees
to Ishterebinth. When Nil’giccas refuses to
return Jiricet to Ûmerau, Nicarû-Telesser II
expels all Nonmen from the Ûmeri Empire.
Omindalea conceives by the union and dies
bearing Anasûrimbor Sanna-Jephera (825-
1032), called ‘Twoheart.’ After a house-slave
conceives by him, Sanna-Jephera is adopted
by Sanna-Neorjë as his heir.
- The cuneiform script and the syllabaries of
the Nonmen are outlawed and replaced with a
consonantal alphabet, c.835.[/quote:352m9453]

Wow, that was a real tasty morsel... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> I tend to repeat myself, but I sure wish TTT were already out...

Also a confirmation that the Anasûrimbor are a very old house. Are there any of comparable age in the Three Seas?

I see that the Anasûrimbor have Nonman blood. How significant is this, did it account for their success as a House? Does it give them some special advantages over ordinary human blood?

What was Sanna-Jephera's lifespan? Did he die of natural causes and if not how long would he have lived?

Also, can you tell us something more on the Ûmeri Empire?

Thanks a lot! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 01 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:2afosg87
To answer those you'll just have me cutting and pasting from the appendices, WL. Patience, my friend. Patience. <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->[/quote:2afosg87]

That's cruel... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Can you at least tell me whether this Rape was really a rape or the opposite of it? view post


A few questions . . . posted 07 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:1kgq7ehx
There's something to be said about historical indeterminacy, WL. I want Earwa to be as realistic as possible, which means I have to inject all the same indeterminacies that plague our world.[/quote:1kgq7ehx]

OK, I get you... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->


Anyway, I'd like to know if Jiricet is still alive (since it seems Mekeritrig is still in fine shape after 2500+ years), and if he was/is related in any way to Nil'giccas.

Thanks! view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 07 February 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Erthaelion&quot;:adafy7fj
I speak neither of physiognomy nor the possible complexity of engineering. The way the skin spy operates, from what we read of Sarcellus, is on the promise of release. Its simply alot harder to imagine a sexual misfit as a female, on that vivid a level.

Not imposssible, but harder to visualize it being the same sickening creature, bent on release, coupling with corpses etc.[/quote:adafy7fj]

Yes, but then again these things are not human (or even natural), so it doesn't matter at all what they look like, or what their sex is. You simply cannot attribute any human traits to them. They could look like five-year-olds of either sex and still have these inhuman hungers and urges. view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 07 February 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;anor277&quot;:r4q2jh9n
Regarding the observation that we've seen no "female" skin-spies, wasn't there a scene when it was implied that one of Esmenet's fellow prostitutes was a closet skin-spy?[/quote:r4q2jh9n]

From what I remember of that scene there wasn't any description of the skin-spy but it was stated that it was impersonating a female prostitute.

This makes me think of the confrontation between Sarcellus and Cnaiur in TWP where Sarcellus tells Cnaiur that his flesh had been folded more times than a steel blade. We also know that the skin-spies are extremely flexible, and have no bones.

This makes me think that they are not only able to shift faces but body shape as well. view post


A few questions . . . posted 08 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:ys78gd0h
I have no clue. You struck world-building bottom with that one! Who knows, though, he might find a place as things develop. <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->[/quote:ys78gd0h]

OK. I really hope we can see more of him... <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->


Now on to some questions:

1. I'd like to know how many people you would guess live in the Three Seas right now, and how many in Zeum.

2. Unions between Men and Nonmen. Were they rare/unheard of before and after the Tutelage? Just what did they think about it? From what you posted on Jiricet and Omindalea I'd guess that was the first time it ever happened. So did the Nonmen still look down on Men even after so many years of contact?

3. What is the Nonmen's religion? Did it in any way influence the Kunniat faith of the Ancient North?

4. The skin-spies. Are there any female skin-spies? Can they reproduce or are they "grown" artificially. Also can they shift body shape as well as face?

Thanks a lot! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 08 February 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;anor277&quot;:1austdb7
Maybe we’ll have to wait for Achamian, or Kellhus, or someone with a few brains and a scalpel to perform a proper autopsy on a dead skin spy – so far all the emperor's gofers or those of the Scarlet Spires have done is to cut off their heads. Then again, maybe they didn’t find anything remarkable about their bodies.[/quote:1austdb7]

I'm sure there'll be at least some more info on the skin-spies in TTT. I'm not sure all of them have been eliminated from the Holy War by the end of TWP, so much could still happen in Book 3.

I put a question about them to Scott so let's hope he can give us at least a partial answer... view post


Moenghus as Harbinger posted 08 February 2005 in The Thousandfold ThoughtMoenghus as Harbinger by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;anor277&quot;:eqxakq9y
Regarding the prophecy, it is true that there are 2 Anasurimbors in the three seas; in a few months there will be a third, Esmenet's child; for all we know he is the Anasurimbor referred to in the prophecy if indeed the prophecy is valid. Esmenet's child will necessarily be "world born", but with Kellhus and Esmenet (and Achamian?) as his teachers, he might surpass both father and grandfather (and why do I assume that Esmenet's child will be a he?)[/quote:eqxakq9y]

I've thought about the Celmomian Prophecy a lot and I've come to a few conclusions.

First of all, I think we can consider Kellhus to really be the Harbinger. In order for him to be the Harbinger he has to be known as an Anasurimbor, and since Moenghus has done his best not to be identified as one, it's safe to assume the role of Harbinger is Kellhus's. After all he did warn the people who count (more or less) about what's about to happen, and with time to spare...

Now we come to the second consideration. Kellhus's son (I also think it'll be a son, and his name will be Celmomas <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->). Somewhere in TWP Kellhus thinks about the Consult, the Apocalypse and mortality. He concludes that the only way to beat time and death is through sons. So I think the person Celmomas talks about in the prophecy could be (in part) Kellhus's son.

If we reckon the Apocalypse will start some twenty years after the conclusion of PoN, and that it will last long enough for Kellhus to grow old or die <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->, (unless he becomes an immortal god in the meantime <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->) the only person who can reasonably live to gain victory over the Consult is Kellhus's son.

Just a few thoughts... looking forward to comments! view post


A few questions . . . posted 14 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:3b17idk1
All told, I would say the population of the Three Seas would hover around 75 million - just somewhat larger than that of the Roman Empire circa 300CE. Since Zeum has a big role to play in the future books, I'll take a pass on answering that one <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: --> [/quote:3b17idk1]

That's a lot more people than I expected . . . Lots of manpower to draw from for any future bloodshed <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> <!-- s:wink: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=":wink:" title="Wink" /><!-- s:wink: -->

It also seems Zeum is to remain a mystery for some time . . . However I'd like to know where you would put this civilization in relation to the Three Seas and the Ancient North.

From the appendices it seems it has always been somewhat monolithic (from Angka to old Zeum to modern Zeum), without the myriad nations that characterized the Ancient North and the Three Seas.

The assumption is that culture or "advanced" civilization in Earwa started with the Norsirai in the North with the help of the Cunuroi, and then the other races, with the exception of the Scylvendi, were influenced by it.

This we know is the case with the Three Seas. But what of Zeum? Were they influenced by the North or did/do they have an autochthonous advanced civilization? Did they have extensive contact with the North before the Apocalypse? Did they fight in it and did they retain a lot more of that civilization than the Ketyai?

It's just an impression of mine but I think Zeum is actually a bit ahead of the Three Seas, in some areas at least . . . Am I running ahead of myself or is there something to this hunch?

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:3b17idk1
Unions between the races were rare, as you might imagine, but some interbreeding was inevitable. The first recorded mention of it is in the Isuphiryas, which relates the tale of Sirwitta, an Emwama slave, who seduces an u[n]named Cunuroi noblewom[a]n, who later conceives a daughter, Cimoira. This is going waaay back, though, before the Womb-Plague.[/quote:3b17idk1]

A nice bit of information. So what was this Womb-Plague, and were/are Cunuroi women sterile as a consequence? Any little Nonmen around?

I'm also interested in the Emwama's appearance. Which of the present races did they resemble more? Or were they totally unrelated?

As an aside, on the matter of race, can you say whether in far antiquity, before the move to Earwa the Norsirai and Scylvendi were perhaps one people? It's just struck me that these are both light-skinned peoples (with other shared characteristics) so a common origin is not really to be excluded . . .

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:3b17idk1
As for the skin-spies, strictly Verboten![/quote:3b17idk1]

Well I didn't think I'd get much of an answer to this one . . . <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> Will we learn more about the skin-spies in TTT, specifically about what was in my question?

Thanks a lot! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


A few questions . . . posted 18 February 2005 in Author Q &amp; AA few questions . . . by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:5gizymes
Like I say, I want Zeum to be a mystery, to be a 'pregnant unknown' similar to 'Cathay' for the Persians or the Romans. As for the population, don't forget that this number includes Nilnamesh, which is very densely populated.[/quote:5gizymes]

I see . . . <!-- s:cry: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cry.gif" alt=":cry:" title="Crying or Very sad" /><!-- s:cry: --> <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) --> Actually one of my next questions would have concerned Nilnamesh. From a few things you mentioned in TWP I had concluded this was a Satyothi and not a Ketyai nation.

So I guess I'd like to know if Nilnamesh was ever a part of the Ceneian Empire or, alternately, connected in any way to Zeum.

My idea of Cenei is as the equivalent of Rome for the Three Seas: an empire ruling all the lands of the region.

If this is so then I'd guess the Nilnameshi could have been under Ceneian rule.

Can you confirm this?

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:5gizymes
The story of the Womb-Plague will actually be in the appendices to TTT. Suffice to say it was a consequence of the Cuno-Inchoroi wars.[/quote:5gizymes]

Well as soon as I read about it I was reminded of the "every womb a grave . . . for eleven years" bit from Achamian's tale of the Old Wars. The involvement of the Inchoroi in this Womb-Plague seemed inevitable.

I guess if it's a permanent thing many things can be explained, even the rape of Omindalea. After all, I'd guess it must be pretty frustrating not to be able to perpetuate one's line <!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: -->

Guess I'll get the answer in the appendices . . .

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:5gizymes
I'm actually finding it difficult trying to decide what information can be 'safely' released, and what to jealously hold onto. I want the whole cycle of books to be a long, gradual revelation of the world of Earwa, and even though I feel I've come so far with finishing PoN (well, almost finishing!), there just seems to be so much more story![/quote:5gizymes]

It seems I'll have to improve my technique in trying to wheedle out information from you <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

I have my pet theories and I guess it's no surprise to you how even many seemingly insignificant details can be useful in confirming them . . .

Quote: &quot;Cu'jara Cinmoi&quot;:5gizymes
Also there's the fact that I quite often rework things in the course of incorporating details into the narrative proper. Just so you know, WL, much of what I say isn't final until it actually finds itself in print.

Evil, I know... <!-- s:twisted: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_twisted.gif" alt=":twisted:" title="Twisted Evil" /><!-- s:twisted: -->[/quote:5gizymes]

<!-- s:cry: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_cry.gif" alt=":cry:" title="Crying or Very sad" /><!-- s:cry: --> <!-- s;) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_wink.gif" alt=";)" title="Wink" /><!-- s;) -->


Just one closing question: Do trees have any special significance for the Nonmen?

I remember a few scenes from the books that have descriptions of 'great' trees (in the case of the dead Nonman city in the North a dead oak tree), in contexts that are linked to the Cunuroi.

Not to mention the great tree in Kellhus's vision whilst hanging from yet another great tree <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

Now from reading fantasy in general and some folk tales I know certain races are said to live as long as their trees live, i.e. many thousands of years.

Am I on to something or . . . ?

Thanks! <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


Moenghus as Harbinger posted 18 February 2005 in The Thousandfold ThoughtMoenghus as Harbinger by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Andrew&quot;:ddzbcirm
I don't agree with the point about Kellus' son being of great importance with respect to the prophecy or the victory over the consult - kellus is only 40 something. I'm sure that genetically he is a superior individual so he can reasonably remain vigorous and powerful well into his 60's or 70's - recall that the Pragma's who trained Kellus were old.
I think you'd need someone at the height of their powers to take on the No-God/Consult/whoever else - not some 20 yr old pup who lacked the benefit of a Dunyain upbringing. In 20 years Kellus will have mastered the Gnosis plus who knows what other magic and he'll have an empire to lead into war and he'll have his regular dunyain skills. What will his son have?[/quote:ddzbcirm]

Well, that's as may be . . . I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm not really sure if Kellhus's son (or daughter) will be instrumental in winning over the Consult. Still, you'll grant it is significant that both Cnaiur and Kellhus have or are about to have offspring.

I see Kellhus and Cnaiur as the main characters, at least in regard to fighting the Consult. I think we can go along with Proyas in thinking that Cnaiur may be as important a figure as Kellhus himself. So them having sons is to me an important detail for the future storyline.

As far as training goes, I put a question about Dunyain training (and if it could be done outside of Ishual and among grown-up world-born men) to Scott and while he didn't answer he said it was important for the future storyline.

Also bear in mind that both Moenghus and Kellhus are already training their followers in the way of the Logos.

Since I expect Kellhus's son to have all the innate genetic advantages of his father, and also Dunyain training, he could well be a thorn in the side of the Consult.

I'd also remind you of the real-world example of Alexander the Great, or in Earwa of Ikurei Conphas who has won many important battles in his early twenties (I judge him to be in his late twenties when he wins at Kiyuth).

All that said I think we can easily assume that Kellhus's son will be an important player in the tale of the Second Apocalypse. view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 18 February 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Erthaelion'&quot;:38yzp796
I don't think Scott is gonna have anything to do with that question.[/quote:38yzp796]

You're right, he didn't . . . <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) -->

I guess we can infer that they have a big role to play in TTT, and possibly the following series. view post


the emperor Ikurai Xerius III posted 19 February 2005 in The Warrior Prophetthe emperor Ikurai Xerius III by White Lord, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;RevCasy&quot;:1mxoagj4
I don't see why Kellhus wouldn't "rat out" all the skin spies. He and the Consult are pretty much at war now, and revealing the skin spies also strengthens his position in the Holy War.

And though I admit I am not Dunyain, I can't think of a reason to leave any skin spies alive.[/quote:1mxoagj4]

Yes, but then again, how many tens of thousands are there in the Holy War?

Kellhus is not (yet) omnipotent and I'd guess that even for him it would be a bit of a trial to sift the skin-spies out of so many people.

I guess the answer lies in training his followers in being able to recognise the skin-spies. I'm not saying he doesn't want to get rid of them, just that it will take a lot of effort and in the meantime they will probably be able to do much damage. view post


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