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Do you believe a God exists? posted 30 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

What I wonder is if God/gods/whatever also have free will. I would assume so. You can't really grant someone something you yourself do not have (but hey, I'm not one to guess the thoughts/movements of God/gods).

As one's free will ceases to be their free will when it is stopped short by another's free will (the criminal being sent to prison being a good example of this) it sort or stands to reason that God/gods granted us free will but also can interrupt it with their own goals/plans/games/etc.

This also could explain why it seems like God/gods have abandoned certain people/all of us. Maybe they just got sick of us or something.

If they exist. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 30 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by target, Auditor

Quote: "Ashaman0":2qovcgfj
which is probably why it bugs me so much when people (e.i. my g/f) think Im not a good person because I dont dedicate my life to God/Jesus or go and repent/pray.[/quote:2qovcgfj]

You see, that's why im slightly opposed to religion, especially the Roman Catholic. Its all a religion of guilt: Christ dies for our sins so we should worship him and dedicate our lives to his name etc etc. The people who really aren't good people are very often Catholics themselves. They persecute and oppose people of other faiths, criticising them for not sharing their beliefs and not being god Christians, finding it incredibly hard to do something their religion is based on: forgiveness. I find the best example of this is in the US where Christianity is a huge religion, but still there is an incredible amount of racism and intollerance of other religions.

Best imo to agree to dsagree with them and inform them kindly that they cannot run our lives and that we are all free to believe what we will believe. And if that doesnt work, just start listing all the Christian atrocities throughout the years and point out shortcommings of the faith. I hope it doesnt get to that though, its never a nice place to go. As far as im concerned people can believe what they like and until im proven wrong then thats what ill continue to believe <!-- s:) --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_smile.gif" alt=":)" title="Smile" /><!-- s:) --> view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 30 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

The probably isn't religion per se...it is organized religion. Any religion where they sit down and tell you "this is what you think" can only lead to bad things. If you consider yourself to be more of a non-denomanational Christian (for example) I think you are better off than someone who follows the what their priest says verbatim.

While I'm not 100% confident in my beliefs I'd say I believe in God and a lot of Jesus' teachings (so basically just the Gospels for me). That cuts out a lot of the "it is immoral to do this! and that! and this!" I think, but keeps a lot of the "love they neighbor" and "do unto others as you would have them do unto you."

Essentially it lets you be a religious person without being some mindless being that believes everything they are told.

Not that you even have to be a non-denomanational Christian to be a moral person. Just saying that is my basic standing. I hate it when people equate atheism or agnosticism with demon worship or general evil behavior. Most of the people I know who are atheists and agnostics are better people than the religious nutjobs I know. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 31 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Ashaman0, Commoner

I must say as far as how good of a person someone is, the people in my life who are farthest from religion are the best people. The closer you get the worse they are. I know this girl whos pentacostal (forgive me if thats spelled wrong) and her parents/church are crazy. The head of her church literaly tells her parents what she can do, what she can wear, and where she can go to school. Shirts past the elbows, pants, or skirt at the ankle, and long hair no exceptions. The pastor tells them who they can be friends with and who they can talk to. Its crazy, i mean at that point its not even about God anymore, its just a cult. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 31 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

Yeah exactly. I hate that shit. And as Scott points out numerous times in PoN: The convert is ever the hardliner.

I find that to be very true in real life. Everyone I know that has converted to a religion or is a "born again christian" is some crazy fundamentalist who yells hellfire and brimstone lines at me straight from the bible or famous religious figures. It pisses me off. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 31 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by target, Auditor

Fundamentalism is the worst of the lot, and imo one of the scariest religions on the planet, just look at Gibson and his dad. I think Deerow is right on the 'organised' religion point. Fortunately for me, even though i know many Christians, none are too uptight (well one is, he, his family and girlfriend play Bibleopoly - now thats just wrong) which is great cause i dont get the teachings rammed down my throat or criticised for not being a 'good' Christian. Plus, they generally listen to me and as long as i dont attack their religion we can have some good theological debates.

As for the born-again Christian, look no further than our good old friend in the White House. What is currently going on in Iraq etc. is hardly more than what is happening in PoN, buti dont want to associate the words here, hopefully you know what im getting at. Unsurprisingly, Islam has responded with Jihad. Although, to be fair, Jihad was called before the war, and against 'the West' because (surprise, surprise) we dont do things the way they do. I wish everyone could just try ad tollerate each other for a change instead of fighting for dominion and hegemony over others. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 31 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by RedShift, Candidate

Personally, I view myself as either agnostic or Christian-in-waiting. That is to say, I don't get faith.
Having been raised a Christian, I'm pretty familiar with the Bible, and I like Chrisitianity. I just don't happen to believe it. I don't understand how people can truly believe in something that have no real proof of, nothing at all, and can still tell you that they know that Christ died for them. If God is up there (and for some reason I have an irrational belief that there is some form of deity around somewhere, possibly due to my upbringing) then He knows exactly what will inspire that strange thing called faith in me, and I'm happy to wait for it. Sooner would be nice, but until then I can get along trying to be a good person, and if the occasional prayer helps me feel a bit stronger in the face of temptation, so much the better.

As for Christianity in general, I don't trust the Bible that much, or, for that matter, anyone who does. I believe Genesis is metaphorical. The scientific view of the world makes to much sense not to be true, and Genesis works just as well as a metaphor. Besides, I very much doubt that Moses could have comprehended the theory of evolution, had God tried to convey it to him. The Bible (assuming it is what it says it is) is the Word of God passed on through man, and is thus fallible. Often prejudiced men. I refuse to believe that God will damn everyone who led a fundamentally good life but just ticked the wrong box on the form, as it were. And the constant promises of reward in heaven smack more of man than of the divine. Is the desire for a reward in heaven a good reason to follow a religion? Enlightened acceptance of its moral precepts or a mystical experience and love of its God, yes. Greed (which is effectively what it is), no. Back to the metaphorical nature of much of the Bible, of course people can complain, "If you say that Genesis is metaphorical, then surely you can start saying that about the rest!" Hell yeah. Take most of the time periods, for example. Forty days is taken, even by the most serious Bible scholars, to just be a stand-in for a long time, and three days pops up too much to be literal. The problem I have is with people who feel unable to think that the Bible could be wrong even in the tiniest sense, and that science must always give way to religion. People like that who are unable to take a logical look at their religious beliefs (and perhaps *gasp* even doubt a little) are moral invertebrates and shouldn't be allowed out without adult supervision <!-- s:evil: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_evil.gif" alt=":evil:" title="Evil or Very Mad" /><!-- s:evil: -->

Doubt, I feel, is a keystone in this matter. The ability to doubt says that you are a reasoning human being, no matter how strong your mystical (and I don't mean that word in a degoratory way, I have great respect for reasonable mysticism) side is. Someone earlier asked why God would create humans if he knew we would betray him. To be quite frank, would you want to be worshipped and be loved by a bunch of people who were completely innocent? Had no knowledge? Trusted you almost blindly? I (taking the great presumption of imagining I was God) would far prefer the love of a people who had seen all the temptations of the world and still turned to God. So perhaps suffering is necessary for our own spiritual growth.

Throughout all this, I am always reassured by the fact (or belief) that if there is a God, he will understand what we go through, whether because he became human in Christ, or because he encompasses the universe. If there is no God, then I will still die content in the belief that I have lived a life that has contributed to the world and that if there is ever a reckoning, I will be able to stand up and say, "I tried, and I am merely human."

That turned into more of a ramble than I expected...

EDIT: Just wanted to note that I don't really want to comment that much on spirituality and mysticism because, frankly, I can't experience it myself, so I'm not really qualified. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 31 August 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

While I agree with a lot of your post I wanted to point something out from my own perspective:

While not necessarily one who "buys into" the religious side of the argument, as it were, I also don't "buy into" the scientific one. This puts me in a weird place because I tend to be outcast by both sides as I basically see them as two sides of the same coin.

To explain as quickly as possible: I don't trust either. To me religion is assigning meaning to things we cannot understand the meaning of and science is convincing ourselves that we do understand the meaning of things that we cannot understand the meaning of. So. I dunno. I guess that labels me a skeptical nihilist or something.

Anyone with me on this? view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 01 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by RedShift, Candidate

I suppose you could class science and religion as "two sides of the same coin", in that they both really rely on faith. For all our experimentation, we still can't state things as facts, truly. All we can say is that until this moment, everything has always obeyed the law of gravity. That dosen't mean it exists. It could just be an immense coincidence. It could be God playing a massive practical joke on us.
That's how I view that, but I thin you were trying to say something different, and I just want to question whether, as you said, we cannot hope to understand the universe (by understand I do not mean be able to comprehend its entire state at any one time). Vast amounts of complexity can result from very simple rules, like in the game Go, for example. Lots of complexity and strategy, but you can "understand" the basis of it very easily. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 01 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

Well you pretty much hit the nail on the head with your first paragraph. Science is as much a "leap of faith" as religion is. It just focuses on two completely different types of faith. One is believing in something we cannot see and the other is believing we see something that may not be there at all. I don't feel that either of these options hold more weight than the other, none a more viable option. Either way we're in the dark.

As for you second question I think it may be possible to have some comprehension of the universe. I just think right now we are attempting to do this through two vehicles that are far to involved at looking inside their own little boxes that they can't step out and try to think of another way to go about doing things.

That being said I have absolutely no method of my own. I was raised in a fairly religious household surrounded by friends that were atheists and agnostics...over time I just sort of saw the similarites rather than the differences and now can't really say I belong to one side over the other.

Simplicity just may be the answer. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 10 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by AjDeath, Didact

Quote: &quot;Deerow&quot;:2ypj4xe0
Well you pretty much hit the nail on the head with your first paragraph. Science is as much a "leap of faith" as religion is. It just focuses on two completely different types of faith. One is believing in something we cannot see and the other is believing we see something that may not be there at all. I don't feel that either of these options hold more weight than the other, none a more viable option. Either way we're in the dark.

As for you second question I think it may be possible to have some comprehension of the universe. I just think right now we are attempting to do this through two vehicles that are far to involved at looking inside their own little boxes that they can't step out and try to think of another way to go about doing things.

That being said I have absolutely no method of my own. I was raised in a fairly religious household surrounded by friends that were atheists and agnostics...over time I just sort of saw the similarites rather than the differences and now can't really say I belong to one side over the other.

Simplicity just may be the answer.[/quote:2ypj4xe0] <!-- s:!: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_exclaim.gif" alt=":!:" title="Exclamation" /><!-- s:!: --> <!-- s:? --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_confused.gif" alt=":?" title="Confused" /><!-- s:? --> Empiricle Evidence is a cult!

I have already said the same thing earlier, but I now admit I was fully wrong, confused. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 10 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by AjDeath, Didact

Quote: &quot;Echoex&quot;:2rndyldv
"I believe that there is something greater than us and that we are part of some purpose but I don't think that anyone can know exactly what that purpose is or can fully comprehend a being that is so much more than us."

Can I ask why you believe that we're part of some purpose? Can we not be random and anomalous?

I think the human ego is too fragile and soft to accept that our existence is really meaningless.[/quote:2rndyldv]Exactly, but I would add that most of the craziness that peopole conform to is because they are really, really afraid to die. Subconciously it is always there, I know that is pretty obvious. <!-- s:idea: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_idea.gif" alt=":idea:" title="Idea" /><!-- s:idea: --> But people don't seem to realize it. We try to reach immortality and avoid the uknown any way we can. If that means believing in superman God to comfort a mind, good for them. Stop proselytization though. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 10 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Deerow, Auditor

Quote: &quot;AjDeath&quot;:17bqvnvz
Empiricle Evidence is a cult![/quote:17bqvnvz]

Considering we invented it how can we trust it anymore than religious evidence (which we also invented). That is all I'm saying. It is pretty hypocritical to say that one is right and one is wrong because neither are based in absolute truth (whatever that is) but based on human beings attempting to explain the universe. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 10 September 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by AjDeath, Didact

Quote: &quot;Deerow&quot;:1ub30r43
Quote: &quot;AjDeath&quot;:1ub30r43
Empiricle Evidence is a cult![/quote:1ub30r43]

Considering we invented it how can we trust it anymore than religious evidence (which we also invented). That is all I'm saying. It is pretty hypocritical to say that one is right and one is wrong because neither are based in absolute truth (whatever that is) but based on human beings attempting to explain the universe.[/quote:1ub30r43]I agree but only to an extent. I will trust a scientist or doctor to cure me rather than relgion because it actually works. Also science is no leap of faith, that is laughable. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 03 October 2005 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Jesh, Candidate

No I don't. I believe in unity. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 06 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

God Almighty, Jesus Christ our Savior. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 12 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by glaz, Peralogue

a born again christian through and through.

yup, i believe in God view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 14 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

I have to say that it's easy, in this day and age, to incriminate mainstream Chritianity and its claim as the one true religion, simply because of the direction that modern society has taken. I think it has to do with the fact that much of the progression that society has made has stemmed from a deviance from mainstream institutions, such as monarchies.
Also, I know a lot of people who have expierienced how imperfect and mortal Christians can be while they claim that the rest of the world is going to hell because of their imperfections. Christians have become easy targets, and mostly because of their own damned frailty and greed, and so we label them as hypocrites with &quot;holier than thou&quot; attitudes.
I can't deny that this is mostly true, but amoung these hypocrites, I stand. And I won't pretend that the Christian church is infallible, or say that I'm any better than you or these hypocrites that I mentioned before, but for me, hypocracy in people is no grounds to discredit the existance of God. And I would like to apologize to the people who have been wronged in any way by the Christian church. Feel free to openly blame me or any other christian, but before you discredit the existance of my God, keep in mind that to believe in him, you don't have to take on the attitudes or the frailties of the church.

That said, I would have to say, yes, I believe in a God, and he does happen to fit the description of the God mentioned in the Christian Bible and in the Torah. And, no, I don't believe in him, blindly, or because it's convenient for me to believe in him, but because, his existance, and the status of Jesus as his son, simply makes sense(ask me why, I dare you). Also, I greatly appreciate the views and religions of others, and that, for thier lives, believing what they do makes sense for them. I also like to think of life in terms of modern Science and Philosophy in coexistance with God. So there, I am a Christian, by bare definition only. haha...maybe the only reason I stick to my beliefs is because most people I know discredit them with sound, reliable evidence and I just like to be different...I have to say though, overall, I agree with target the most....oh yeah, please show me the error of my ways....I'd love to know any fault anybody sees in my belief! <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> seriously! view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 14 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

Jeez, I just can't stay away from this forum...it's the thread that never dies!! anyway, I keep seeing this reoccuring idea here that being a &quot;good person&quot; has somthing to do with being a Christian....not true...in it's purest form, Christianity should have nothing to do with being a good person. It's simply the belief that there is a God and he had a son...so and a so forth...but whether or not you're a good person has nothing to do with whether or not you get into heaven, according to the Bible anyway. It's simply believing that Jesus is God's son and he died for us so we could live. That's it...I think the ten commandments are a good suggestion, but you can't get into heaven by good acts. I think a lot of Christians fail to realize this as well, and so maybe that's why this idea of if you be good, you'll go to heaven keeps showing up view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 15 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Warrior-Poet, Moderator

I loved that last mention of just becuase your good doesnt mean your going to heaven finnally someone mentions that. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by glaz, Peralogue

Quote: &quot;Edge of Certainty&quot;:14xjawy4
Jeez, I just can't stay away from this forum...it's the thread that never dies!! anyway, I keep seeing this reoccuring idea here that being a &quot;good person&quot; has somthing to do with being a Christian....not true...in it's purest form, Christianity should have nothing to do with being a good person. It's simply the belief that there is a God and he had a son...so and a so forth...but whether or not you're a good person has nothing to do with whether or not you get into heaven, according to the Bible anyway. It's simply believing that Jesus is God's son and he died for us so we could live. That's it...I think the ten commandments are a good suggestion, but you can't get into heaven by good acts. I think a lot of Christians fail to realize this as well, and so maybe that's why this idea of if you be good, you'll go to heaven keeps showing up[/quote:14xjawy4]

you just underlined my whole belief for me. thanks for driving the point <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Randal, Auditor

because, his existance, and the status of Jesus as his son, simply makes sense(ask me why, I dare you)


Why? <!-- s:twisted: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_twisted.gif" alt=":twisted:" title="Twisted Evil" /><!-- s:twisted: -->


As for the division between believers/nonbelievers rather than between good people and bad people deciding one's fate after death... that's one interpretation of Christianity I could never subscribe to even if I did believe in the truth of their teachings. It just strikes me as an unjust us-against-them mentality... it doesn't really bother me, as to me it's just a tale, but I don't really like the people who tend to subscribe to ideas like this either. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

Quote: &quot;Randal&quot;:1zpitrsn
because, his existance, and the status of Jesus as his son, simply makes sense(ask me why, I dare you)


Why? <!-- s:twisted: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_twisted.gif" alt=":twisted:" title="Twisted Evil" /><!-- s:twisted: --> [/quote:1zpitrsn]

Why you evil son of a...just kidding <!-- s:lol: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_lol.gif" alt=":lol:" title="Laughing" /><!-- s:lol: --> . Uh....why not?...what I shoulda said was it makes sense for me...then again, what makes sense for me makes little sense to most other people... <!-- s:( --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_sad.gif" alt=":(" title="Sad" /><!-- s:( --> . Why's it such a bad thing, tho, to have faith solely for the purpose of having faith? ooops, I said the f word. I think the idea of deviating from (or just not believing) in faith (without interior motives, that is) stems from the idea that somthing like that could only hinder the betterment of society, and that's not entirely true. For, me, I guess, having faith in somthing couldn't hurt...that is if your faith is pure and you don't have any interior motives (i.e. the blind, lazy belief in a god for the sake of self betterment). In other words, my philosophy is faith for the sake of faith...and I'm content with that. But I'd be only too glad to continue this discussion <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> .

As for the whys and whys nots of getting into heaven, I've had problems with that myself. When you have a document that's been translated and re-translated from a pan of several different languages and interpretations, it's hard to say that things haven't been changed up, just alittle. That may sound like trying to interpret the Bible how I want to, but I'm not saying what parts are right and what parts are slightly changed, just acknowledging the possibility... view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by gierra, Sorcerer-of-Rank

i really can;t be bothered to read through 8 pages of this, so i'll just leave my bit...

i believe in god, but not as some being, but as a force of energy that gave us life. everything has a cause and effect, so if life began on this planet, there had to be something to cause it.

i'm pretty vehemently anti-christians*, and i find it hilarious when others think this is simply a rebellion, that it's 'cool' to not be christian. which i don't buy for a moment. i was never baptised, i've neve rgone to church in my life (aside from weddings and funerals) and i was never brought up to believe in such things.

*i'd like to add that i'm not necessarily against christianity itself. it seems like a good enough religion, in theory. no worse than any other. but somewhere along the lines, its believers messed it up and started killing in the name of their meek and gentle lord. i cannot believe in something that people have used for such atrocities. i also know many good hearted christians who are willing to allow others their freedom to believe what they want. others, preach and evangelize and it makes me sick. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

<!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> , I yield...you're right, christians have done some pretty stupid stuff and alot of us have perverted the faith, I think anyway, from the original intent. And as for the preaching and evangelizing, I know what you mean..I literally coulda puked the first time a preacher told me I was goin to hell...I wasn't raised in a christian family, but i had this friend who was a christian and his outlook on life was so cool and not once did he ever mention christianity or try to impose his beliefs on me. but i justed liked him as a person and his philosophies just...made sense...even to this day, most of the things he tought me i still believe. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by gierra, Sorcerer-of-Rank

oh i agree, i do have christian friends that are just fantastic.. but i'm a good person, i'm compassionate and loving, and have a similar take on life as them.. but because i do not accept jesus, that makes them so much better? i cannot accept that.

besides, even if i could, i just have too many qualms with too many things.. i prefer to think for myself.

i think the bible is cool tho. i just see it as a collection of cultural stories, just like the mabinogion or the baghavad gita (sp?)... it's a great -story- view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Randal, Auditor

EoC: I suppose that answers my question... sort of.

I'll agree that having faith in something won't hurt. (unless it's used to justify crimes/hate/discrimination/whatever) Not sure it's a positive trait either, though that's neither here nor there.

But I couldn't for the life of me understand it. Sure, have faith in something. But how the hell would one do that? If you offered me a billion euros if I'd just believe in god, or Zeus, or psychic powers, or anything... I couldn't. I wouldn't even know where to begin. It boggles my mind, really, this concept of faith. Intellectually accepting the possibility of some &quot;prime mover&quot; godlike being is one thing, but I can't actually believe anything supernatural exists unless someone shows me at least some half-decent evidence.

I seem to recall some research that indicated that religiosity is (at least in part) a hereditary trait. If that's so, I ended up without any of it. Can't say that I mind, though the concept of religion does intrigue me to no end just because it's so unfathomable to me. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

yeah...that's kinda the retarded thing about faith...it really goes against rational thought and intellectual...anything...that we can understand. Idk if religiosity is somthing inherent, but I think faith is somthing pretty universal. Not necessarily faith in a god or gods or a supreme being or the supernatural or whatever. But just faith in general is somthing that seems to define &quot;world born&quot; men. Like when you put your money in a bank, you generally have faith that, unless you buy somthing, that money's gunna stay there. But you have no real way of knowing that it will cuz the possibilities are endless. The dunyain, of course, know almost all the possibilities and even the most likely among them and so they've ruled out the need for faith. I guess what I'm saying is faith is somthing that we need (unless you're dunyain), despite what it's in. Sorry, again. I'm not trying to impose my beliefs on you, I'm just confirming to myslef what I believe, I guess. <!-- s:roll: --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_rolleyes.gif" alt=":roll:" title="Rolling Eyes" /><!-- s:roll: --> Yeah, it's stubborn, it doesn't listen to reason, but when it comes right down to it, faith just makes sense of a world were the only absolute is uncertainty.

And gierra, I can tell you're a really nice, loving person just talking to you, and no, believing that some dude was savagely murdered doesn't make anyone better in anyway and there is no reason that you should. <!-- s:D --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_biggrin.gif" alt=":D" title="Very Happy" /><!-- s:D --> but believing that it happened, again, goes back to the whole faith thing... view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by gierra, Sorcerer-of-Rank

Quote: &quot;Randal&quot;:ky3bytxb
religiosity.[/quote:ky3bytxb]

this is officially my new favorite word. view post


Do you believe a God exists? posted 17 March 2006 in Philosophy DiscussionDo you believe a God exists? by Edge of Certainty, Subdidact

yeah, and it's a real word too!! <!-- s:o --><img src="{SMILIES_PATH}/icon_surprised.gif" alt=":o" title="Surprised" /><!-- s:o --> I just checked it in spell checker.... view post


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